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Zionism and National Socialism


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#1
Der Löwe

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This subject has been briefly touched upon in the forums on several occasions. However, I would like to formally review it here.

The topic of this post concerns the relationship between the Zionist Organization of the 19th and early 20th century, and National Socialism under Hitler.

This story begins in the middle part of the 19th century.
Moses Hess, a Jewish socialist thinker, first coined the term "National Socialism" in 1862. Where Karl Marx would later view socialism as class struggle, and a struggle with capitalists and the bourgeoisie, Hess understood the struggle of nationalities and race. When Hess said "National Socialism," he applied it to the question of Jewish ethnic nationalism. Initially, there was some mutual understanding, but these different views led to the departure of Hess from Marx in terms of belief. When Marx's socialism became more international and class centric, Hess's was nationalistic and racialist. Hess's beliefs were a foundation of National Socialism, and Marx's became a foundation of Communism. Incidentally, Hess was not just a socialist but also a founder of 19th century Zionism --in addition to Theodor Herzl and Leon Pinsker.

Zionism was not popular among many Jews for the better part of the 19th century. But beginning in the 1880s, Russian Jews began to leave Russia, foreseeing that integration was not only not possible but undesirable. And thus from 1880 to 1914, over 60.000 Jews (mainly Russian) entered Ottoman Palestine. This raised the total Jewish population to 90.000. Jerusalem, prior to 1880 and for a very long amount of time, had a majority Jewish population. But after the 1880 influx the population of Jerusalem grew, and Jews began to establish settlements in the desert and swamp land. Tel Aviv was founded in 1909, and settlements were built along the coast and the largely uninhabitable Judaea region between Tel Aviv and the Dead Sea, and between Haifa and Galilee. By 1914, 18 Russian Jewish settlements were founded and 35 or so other settlements had a majority Russian Jewish population.

Meanwhile in Europe, in 1897 delegates were sent to the first Zionist Congress. Of the 159 delegates, 55 were from Russia and 30 were Russian born. Among other things, a rift grew in the Zionist Congress between German and Russian Jews. Many Russian Jews began to adopt Herzl Zionism and many advocated establishing Bolshevism in Palestine. However, ideas of Jewish Zionist Socialism had developed differently for the opposite group of Zionists. Both agreed, however, that the insistence of Jews in Europe to assimilate would not help the creation of any state. Therefore, it became a goal of the Zionist Congress to devise a way to bring Jews to Palestine.

Under Ottoman rule, Jewish immigration began to be restricted by Turks, and especially so during WWI. Following the British conquest of Syria (and its division into British Mandate Palestine and French Mandate Syria), this Arab nationalist view emerged:

"We Arabs, especially the educated among us, look with deepest sympathy on the Zionist movement... We will wish the Jews a hearty welcome home... We are working together for a reformed and revised Near East, and our two movements complement one another. The movement is national and not imperialistic. There is room in Syria for us both. Indeed, I think neither can be successful without the other."
-Emir Feisal (father of pan Arabism, descendant of Muhammad) to Felix Frankfurter, 3 March 1919.

The British Mandate of Palestine was cut along the Jordan river in 1921. Palestine east of the Jordan river was referred to as "Transjordan" and it was closed to Jewish settlement. The present day area of the Golan was ceded by Britain to the French Mandate of Syria in 1923. The process of now bringing Jews to the mandate became a necessity.

The rise of National Socialism in Germany:
Dietrich Bronder in Bevor Hitler Kam demonstrates how Hitler was financed by Jews to bring him to power. Support for what was ultimately Aryan zionism was widespread among the members of the Zionist Congress and the Zionist Organization. This same Zionist Congress voted in favour of Hitler, by 240 to 43. Zionist leader Georg Kareski was also supportive of Nuremburg laws. And he gave his support in Der Angriff, in a 23 December 1935 interview.
Previously, Göbbels newspaper had published concerning the "jüdischer faschist." Related to Leopold von Wildenstein's visit to Palestine. The flag depicting the Star of David became the only flag allowed to fly alongside the flag depicting the Swastika. In May 1935 of Das Schwarzkopf, the SS became openly Zionist as well.

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But the causes for this are earlier.
The rise of the Anti Semitic Party in early 20th century Germany offered a solution to Zionism. The problem was that anti semitism was marginalized. Very early, Zionists recognized the need to use "anti semitism" in the goal of relocating Jews to Palestine. The collaboration of the Zionists with the National Socialists then allowed many Jews to change their papers to Aryan documents.
(Bevor Hitler Kam) Heinrich Himmler, Josef Göbbels, Wilhelm Canaris, and Alfred Rosenberg were examples of people with Jewish heritage who were afforded the opportunity to change their papers to suggest they only had Aryan ancestry. Rosenberg was influenced in his racialism by the Talmud, and Göbbels wife was raised by a Jewish family.
Deputy chancellor of the Reich, Rudolf Hess, was born in Egypt to a Jewish mother. Julius Streicher, editor of Der Sturmer, was a Jew. During the Nuremburg trials he said, "Our model was the Jewish law." At these trials, his real name (Abraham Goldberg) was also publicized. Labour Minister Robert Ley was Jewish. Reinhard Heydrich had Jewish ancestry on his mother's family. Albrecht Haushofer was a Jew in the German foreign ministry. Hitler's wife, Eva Braun was half Jewish and had been introduced to Hitler by the half Jew Heinrich Hoffman. SS officer Adolf Eichmann had Jewish ancestry. SS generals Odilo Globocnik and Erich von dem Bach-Zelewski were also.
What is interesting is not that the NSDAP was occupied by many Jews, but that anti semitism became a tool of Zionism.


In 1933, Hitler and the Zionist Organization signed an agreement for the emigration of Jews to Palestine. (The movement which was overseen by Adolf Eichman, and other National Socialist visitors to Palestine). In 1934, 120.000 German Jews had emigrated. By 1940, 500.000 German Jews had emigrated. However, many Jews continued to emigrate within Europe rather than move to Palestine.
Based on non anti-nazi propaganda Ingrid Weckert found in archives, unknown people who claimed to be party leaders started destroying synagogues 7 November 1938. There were no orders given by the real heads of the NSDAP, because they were celebrating the 1923 Munich Coup. Those responsible for Kristallnacht were not even real members of the NSDAP.
When news of Kristallnacht began, SA commander Viktor Lutze ordered Jewish property should not be damaged, and warned of SA intervention to protect Jewish property. Evidence shows SA members began to guard Jewish shops that had been vandalized. The SS and the police soon restored law and order.
Heinrich Himmler had Reinhard Hydrich end the demonstrations and protect the Jews. At 1 am, Hitler was informed. He ordered the demonstrations to be stopped. At 3 am Hitler sent an order that read, "From the highest authority: Arson or assault on Jewish shops or other Jewish property must not occur under any circumstances."
9 November: Göbbels came on the radio and ordered a stop to violence against Jews. This is documented. Ingrid Weckert shows that the Jewish B'nai B'rit group later was responsible for the Kristallnacht attack. The goal was to encourage emmigration of Jews to Palestine. The National Center for Jewish Emigration was formed after Kristallnacht.

However, the National Socialists were not the only ones to support Zionism explicitly. The Zionists naturally supported the National Socialists even without regards to the positive settlement of Jews in Palestine or the Talmudic supportive Nuremburg laws. Mussolini established squadrons of the Revisionist Zionist youth. The Beitar are modeled after the SS. Menachem Begin, Prime Minister of Israel, was a member of Beitar and Stern Gang. His uniform reflected this, and among his comrades, he would give the fascist salute. Before the collapse of Germany, it was hoped for a future between Zionists, Fascists, and National Socialists.



Atlas of Jewish History, 1969/1992 Martin Gilbert
Rom und Jerusalem, die Letzte Nationalitätsfrage 1862 Moses Hess
http://www.ihr.org/j...4p29_Weber.html
http://www.ihr.org/j...p14_Irving.html
The Iron Wall 1984 Leni Brenner
Bevor Hitler Kam: Eine Historische Studie, 1975 Dietrich Bronder
Feuerzeichen: Die Reichskristallnacht, 1981 Ingrid Weckert
http://www.ihr.org/j...p-2_Irving.html

#2
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Nazi Germany… just another Jewish conspiracy.

FcpJCeY.png?1

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#3
British Blackshirt

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I do NOT believe Joseph Goebbels, Streicher (!), Himmler etc were 'Jewish'! It's just as ludicrous as those who tell us Hitler himself was a Jew, because his grandmother was called 'Shicklgruber'! However...the book 'Hitler's Jewish Soldiers: The Untold Story of Nazi Racial Laws and Men of Jewish Descent in the German Military' by Bryan Mark Rigg is an interesting read. The NSDAP Race Laws forbade intermarriage between Germans and Jews to preserve the Aryan Race.

It is true that some Zionists collaborated with the Nazis because they thought that anti-Semitism in the Reich and the policy of 'Germany for the Germans', would lead to a Jewish State in Palestine. Adolf Eichmann had negotiated with Jewish leaders to try to ensure Jewish resettlement outside Germany. After the War the Zionists condemned German National Socialism and the alleged 'Holocaust', and Eichmann was kidnapped and executed in the new State of Israel.

I agree with the policy of Oswald Mosley, Leader of the British Union of Fascists and National Socialists who supported a State for the Arabs in Palestine within the British Empire and a Homeland for the Jews somewhere in the World, which would not displace native peoples.

#4
Talleyrand

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It's just as ludicrous as those who tell us Hitler himself was a Jew, because his father was called Shicklegruber!

Shicklegruber = shekel grabber. If that's not Jewish I don't know what is.
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#5
British Blackshirt

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Shicklegruber = shekel grabber. If that's not Jewish I don't know what is.


"Hitler's father Alois Hitler was the illegitimate child of Maria Anna Schicklgruber. It was not until 1876 that Alois was legitimated and the baptismal register changed by a priest before three witnesses...Historians doubt the claim that Alois was Jewish." (Wikipedia)

#6
Der Löwe

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Nazi Germany… just another Jewish conspiracy.

Many 19th century thinkers considered Aryanism and Aryans the Jewish counterpart. So perhaps an alliance and not a conspiracy.

I do NOT believe

This is well documented by several historians. David Irving, Bryan Rigg. Dietrich Bronder also, given his access to many NSDAP documents from before 1933.
It is not something that requires belief.

Joseph Goebbels

Was called "rabbi" in school. His first girlfriend was Jewish. He defended Jews before in his correspondences. His papers were also changed to reflect Aryanism.
But a new myth and belief was being created. So what was done was necessary for the Aryan mythos. As the Judaic mythos was necesary for Zionism.

Streicher (!)

That Abraham Goldberg was Jewish is not debatable.

Himmler etc were 'Jewish'! It's just as ludicrous as those who tell us Hitler himself was a Jew, because his grandmother was called 'Shicklegruber'!

Hitler was not Jewish. However, there existed some evidence that his lawyer and friend (Hans Frank) was Jewish. Hitler would go to a Czech mystic seer who was also Jewish.
Hitler's parents were probably not Jewish. However, Hitler's father remarried and there is some discussion that Angela Hitler she was half Jewish. http://en.wikipedia....i/Angela_Hitler
After WWI she moved to Vienna and became a manager of a boarding house for Jewish students --Mensa Academia Judaica. Angela was mentioned by Hitler in Mein Kampf.
Also, although Hitler was not Jewish, Eva Braun was.

However...the book 'Hitler's Jewish Soldiers: The Untold Story of Nazi Racial Laws and Men of Jewish Descent in the German Military' by Bryan Mark Rigg is an interesting read. The NSDAP Race Laws forbade intermarriage between Germans and Jews to preserve the Aryan Race.

Or was it to preserve the Jewish race? Zionists disliked the intermarriage equally as much. And Zionists were discussing that they did not like intermarriage years before German National Socialism.
Ironically, this did not stop Hitler from marrying a Jew. Although Zionists, possibly like Hitler, believed there was a conversion process. An Aryan could be Jewish in the way Hitler could declare Jews "Aryan."

Ultimately, who was and was not Aryan began with Hitler. Hitler declared many Jews to be Aryan. In his knowledge, (that we know of) 10 generals and two generalfeldmarschall were Jewish. They were in charge of substantial amounts of troops.
Hitler declared them Aryan.
A further 160.000 soldiers in the Wehrmacht were Jewish or Mischlinge (the more famous German "Helmut Schmidt" was a Jew and a veteran of Leningrad. He was captured by the British and received the Eisernes Kreuz). The decision on Aryanism was Hitler's decision. Arguably, despite his wife's ancestry and the ancestry of many high ranking National Socialists, they were considered Aryan. Because Aryanism could be determined through faith, on some level.

Possibly, this has to due with Rosenberg's Talmudic beliefs. He believed in the Aryan soul as much as genes. Or rather, that the soul was just as powerful. (Similar to the Talmudic Jewish belief in distinctions between animal and super souls, and the effect of one's soul on genes).
I think there was a belief that a soul changed a person's genetics, similar to some Talmudic views.

It is true that some Zionists collaborated with the Nazis because they thought that anti-Semitism in the Reich and the policy of 'Germany for the Germans', would lead to a Jewish State in Palestine.

Rather, they encouraged this anti semitism. Kristallnacht is absolute evidence of this.

Adolf Eichmann had negotiated with Jewish leaders to try to ensure Jewish resettlement outside Germany. After the War the Zionists condemned German National Socialism and the alleged 'Holocaust', and Eichmann was kidnapped and executed in the new State of Israel.

Of course. The allies had won. Conform or lose your head. Many National Socialists in addition to Zionists began to work for the enemy. Former National Socialists worked with both the Russians and the Americans. Zionists are not the only ones.

The fact remains though, Adolf Eichmann is not the only Jew to be killed by later Zionist leaders. And naturally, demonizing National Socialism after its defeat would help to support a history of Holocaust ideology.

The actual NS ideologies of Moses Hess were never really abandoned in Zionism though. Currently, Zionism is ready for a revisionist re awakening, as it has been momentarily subjected to liberalism. National Socialism is also ripe for a return.

I agree with the policy of Oswald Mosley, Leader of the British Union of Fascists and National Socialists who supported a State for the Arabs in Palestine

Technically Jordan is Palestine. The British did the same thing with Palestine that they did with India. They divided Palestine into Transjordan (now Jordan) and Palestine. As they later divided India into India and Pakistan/East Pakistan.
They told the Muslims to go to Pakistan/East Pakistan(now Bangladesh), and the Hindus to leave Pakistani areas and go to India. With Palestine, they wanted Palestine to be for Jews and Transjordan for Muslims.

The Islamic homeland in Palestine is still there, it is merely on the eastern side of the Jordan river.

Frankly, Muslims have homelands all over the planet... So I naturally do lack some sympathy for another random Islamic homeland. Pakistanis did not ask for homelands in India.

which would not displace native peoples.

Aside from the fact Arabs are not indigenous to Palestine, but rather the Arabian peninsula...
It is unlikely Hitler cared about the Jordanian/Palestinian's claim to (western) Palestine when Himmler, Eichmann, and himself sent approximately half a million Jews there.
Adolf Hitler: Founder of Israel, 1996 Hennecke Kardel

I think it is misunderstood just how deep this friendship truly was. Aryanism is racist, but likely no more racist than parts of the Talmud or the Torah. For what Rosenberg wanted (the disappearance of Christianity and the placement of an Aryan nationalist religion), this would be a non-Jewish equivalent of Zionism.
Naturally, this garnered a large amount of respect from many in the Zionist Organization.
I disagree with them on the Christian point, however.

#7
British Blackshirt

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I don't believe Hitler would have married a Jewess, given his opposition to mixed marriages. I don't think Eva Braun was Jewish she was classed as Aryan. Hitler took great pains to research his family tree, after the Jewish controlled newspapers in Germany spread the tall tale of his Jewish ancestry to try and discredit him, before his rise to power. The SS investigation concluded the Fuhrer was Aryan.

It is certainly good if Jews do not mix with us and vice versa, which will preserve both the Aryan and the Jewish races.

Der Lowe... is your avatar symbol based on the Raelian Movement alleged 'UFO cult' which also uses a Swastika and a Star of David?

#8
Der Löwe

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I don't believe Hitler would have married a Jewess, given his opposition to mixed marriages. I don't think Eva Braun was Jewish she was classed as Aryan. Hitler took great pains to research his family tree, after the Jewish controlled newspapers in Germany spread the tall tale of his Jewish ancestry to try and discredit him, before his rise to power. The SS investigation concluded the Fuhrer was Aryan.

Yes, Hitler was Aryan.
Hitler was also often anti semitic as a display to the public.
That Hitler considered the half-jew Eva Braun Aryan is likely. There is more to Zionism and Aryanism than mere ancestry. Indeed at least in many instances, if you looked Aryan, you were Aryan. Or at least you could be declared Aryan.
Or sometimes even if you did not.
Here is a picture of a rather non-Aryan appearing Wehrmacht recruit, Horst Geitner:
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=mO6-P9RfztA

It is certainly good if Jews do not mix with us and vice versa, which will preserve both the Aryan and the Jewish races.

Certainly, I do not believe that either Aryan cultural heritage or Jewish cultural heritage should perish...

Although I can not speak specifically on this for all cases because I would be classified as Mischlinge in the NSDAP. I believe that where the line between the two is not defined, the "spiritual" approach should be taken to determine one or the other.

Der Lowe... is your avatar based on the Raelian Movement 'UFO cult' which uses a Swastika and a Star of David?

Complicated.

Firstly, the Star of David and the Swastika are both Indo European Aryan symbols. Technically.

The Shatkona represents the union of masculine and feminine. It is represented by two triangles pointing in opposite directions. The Swastika is a sun symbol.
Hindu usage of both predates either (Germanic) Aryan or Jewish usage of either.

To me, what this means, is it is merely the combination of two very similar concepts (culturally, "mythically," and ideologically), into one.

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#9
De Hertog

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I do not think that anybody here should be surprised by the notion that Zionism IS National Socialism, adapted to fit the Jewish folk.

Speak softly, and carry a big stick.

 

I'd like to think that Europe has more to unite over than an enlarged and superficial desert cult. (Assburgs Freedom Brigade)

 

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#10
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I do not think that anybody here should be surprised by the notion that Zionism IS National Socialism, adapted to fit the Jewish folk.


That would be denying National-Socialism as a worked out ideology with its own economic and political systems, values and ethics. Indeed Zionism can be seen in a etno-nationalist context and knows some oppurtunist connections (zionism as a possible solution for the Jewish question) with Nazism but that's where the comparison with National-Socialism pretty much ends. As for the reference to Hes, National-Socialism as a term does know a long tradition in (non-marxist) utopian socialist circles (in which Jewish theorists can also be found), but this is by no means exactly the same ideology the NSDAP realized since its foundation. The accusation of Hitlerism being a Zionist plot is quite exorbitant, it must be admitted that the Nazi's where not very consequent in their application of the racial laws and Jews where kept in NSDAP ranks, but outside the existance of a Zionist lobby, that is about all there is to it: National-Socialism was and is a German manifestation!
There exists no form of thought or activity that is not enslaved by materialism. Our hostility is as great towards Capitalism, as against Marxism. Capitalism, by means of poverty or prosperity, reduces the people to a state of servitude incompatible with the dignity of man. It directs whole classes and one's whole personality toward the acquisition of money: that's the only desire that fills the modern soul. Marxism is the rebellious son of Capitalism from which it received its faith in matter.

We believe not in Capitalism which creates class struggle, nor do we believe in Marxism that exploits it; neither in directors who enrich themselves from peoples labour, neither in politicians who make career out of its resentment, neither in conservative blindness, neither in demagogue impudence, neither in egoism, neither in cowardice, neither in left or right!

#11
TotalitarianSocialist

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Theodor Herzl was originally a German/Austrian Nationalist that wanted Jews to integrate. But that would not happen so he though Jews should have their own state. If it was up to him the state would have been secular, socialistic and German-speaking. I really like early Zionism, it is more so European then Jewish. It is proto-NS. If he could see modern Israel he would roll in his grave.

If the Jews had become culturally European I would support them over the Arabs/Palestinians. Sadly that will not happen. I lean towards supporting Arabs as I hate them slightly less then Jews. The problem is Arabs are shitty fighters. They outnumber the Jews they outunumber the Israelis yet have not managed to holocaust them. Jews are not even difficult to holocaust. Millions(I put the holocaust at about 1-3 million) died in the war and barely put up a fight.

#12
watcher

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is this your source dude ?

Aut consilio aut ense


#13
Boia Chi Molla

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yet have not managed to holocaust them. Jews are not even difficult to holocaust.


"For I could wish that I myself were cursed and cut off from Christ for the sake of my people, those of my own race." -Romans 9:3

Now for something different: as we are writing here, millions of rich white nordid females are boarding planes to Jamaica or Ghana, driven by their hunger for black sausage.

 

 


#14
Lord Haw Haw

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The collaboration of the Zionists with the National Socialists then allowed many Jews to change their papers to Aryan documents. (Bevor Hitler Kam) Heinrich Himmler, Josef Göbbels, Wilhelm Canaris, and Alfred Rosenberg were examples of people with Jewish heritage who were afforded the opportunity to change their papers to suggest they only had Aryan ancestry. Rosenberg was influenced in his racialism by the Talmud, and Göbbels wife was raised by a Jewish family. Deputy chancellor of the Reich, Rudolf Hess, was born in Egypt to a Jewish mother. Julius Streicher, editor of Der Sturmer, was a Jew. During the Nuremburg trials he said, "Our model was the Jewish law." At these trials, his real name (Abraham Goldberg) was also publicized. Labour Minister Robert Ley was Jewish. Reinhard Heydrich had Jewish ancestry on his mother's family. Albrecht Haushofer was a Jew in the German foreign ministry. Hitler's wife, Eva Braun was half Jewish and had been introduced to Hitler by the half Jew Heinrich Hoffman. SS officer Adolf Eichmann had Jewish ancestry. SS generals Odilo Globocnik and Erich von dem Bach-Zelewski were also.


Are we expected to take this seriously? Because anybody who knows anything about this topic knows that you are putting this way out of context. You're making leaps and bounds and trying to force pieces of a puzzle that simply do not fit together. These people where not Jews no matter how much you wish they were like you, the honest truth is they are not and they never will be.
"Within their ranks we must strive. In their mind I am a friend. But I will never succumb and be like them. Time will come to unleash this rage. annihilation of their ways. From within I rise to destroy all they have built to suppress us. I walk among them, waiting for the call. The time will come for me to destroy all. I'm the enemy they cannot see, rise to kill their society. From within I rise. Adapt to survive, or forced to slowly die. But I'll never submit, never live their subjective life. From within I find the power to face their outright evil." -Teardown

#15
Der Löwe

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Are we expected to take this seriously? Because anybody who knows anything about this topic knows that you are putting this way out of context. You're making leaps and bounds and trying to force pieces of a puzzle that simply do not fit together. These people where not Jews no matter how much you wish they were like you, the honest truth is they are not and they never will be.

As before stated, they were Aryan even if they had Jewish heritage.

"I decide who is Jew and who is Aryan"
-Hermann Göring

Honestly, you are not a historian. I am prepared to trust real people who "knows anything about this topic" over an unsubstantiated opinion.

Theodor Herzl was originally a German/Austrian Nationalist that wanted Jews to integrate. But that would not happen so he though Jews should have their own state. If it was up to him the state would have been secular, socialistic and German-speaking. I really like early Zionism, it is more so European then Jewish. It is proto-NS. If he could see modern Israel he would roll in his grave.

I touched on the Russian and German divide, but I did not explain enough.
Russian Zionists viewed the pogroms as a positive thing. They began to adopt a later Herzl view of not integrating and instead moving to Palestine.
With the increase of the pogroms and the Tsar's anti Jewish tendencies it led many Russian Jews to Bolshevism (they were anti imperialist, and the Tsar oppressed many people, not just Jews, and I think many Jewish Bolsheviks new this) as well as the eastern branch of Zionism. The eastern Zionist view was very influential, as indicated by their numbers in the Zionist Congress.
They advocated all Zionists adopting the Russian view that anti semitism was a positive factor in emigration to Palestine, as evidenced by the massive 1880 Russian emigration.
German Jews were more likely to integrate. In fact, many of the German Jews who would later be targeted were practicing Protestants or Catholics. This posed a problem for the Zionist Congress, which supported the idea with National Socialism that these Christians were Jews whether they realized it or not.
In terms of actual differences, Russian Jews had never really integrated the same as Germans. While Germans (I include Austria...) had produced Jewish scientists like Freud, father of psychology, Otto Weininger. Much of early racialist thought was from German Jews.
The Russian Jews who were most influential moreover, were Russians who moved west to Germany and could be scientifically or mathematically productive there.
The only eastern European Jews I can think of that were influential in science were ones that were born in America from Eastern European immigrants. People like Stanley Milgram, landmark sociologist.

The Russians also could not agree with the Germans on a language. Germans in the Zionist Congress wanted Jiddisch or German. Russians thought these were "goy" languages (although, many German Jews did not see a problem with this) and wanted Hebrew.
So you are correct in that the current language in Israel does reflect Russian influence.
Ultimately, because the Russians started to colonize Israel first-- It of course would reflect their specific Zionist values. When Germans started to arrive, Hebrew was already strong in many circles and Jiddisch or German were not preferred.

I personally am partial to the 1890s German Zionists. But I like the Russians also, and I do not really have a problem with Hebrew. It has a nice history as one of the oldest existing phonetic alphabets, as a direct branch from the Phoenician alphabet (who invented phonetic alphabets, thus why we call them "phonetic").
Adolf Eichmann wanted to learn Hebrew, and if Hebrew was good for Eichmann I do not see the problem. I do think that Jiddisch should be revived in Israel though.
People say "when in Rome do as the Romans/Andere Länder, andere Sitten" in regard to the need for lingual singularity. But in the Roman Empire, they spoke both Latin and Greek.

National-Socialism was and is a German manifestation!

Yes. That was pro Zionist.
If you have not yet, read on the Nuremberg trials, it is enlightening.
Also, Rosenberg could be considered an Aryan Talmudist.

As to the other things... National Socialism remains German and was German before. But I say that because I consider Moses Hess German (although not Aryan? Unless Hitler would declare him Aryan). His foundation that Race/Nationality is Class, and economic class warfare is not realistic.

If the Jews had become culturally European I would support them over the Arabs/Palestinians.

Yes, because the Arabs are indeed more European. As we are all aware.

But really, why can not western Jordanians just move to East Palestine? I do not see Pakistanis complaining today about leaving India (as many did), so what is wrong with Palestinians? And why do they have a monopoly on "displacement butthurt"? I will criticize them the same I criticize many Jews.

Sadly that will not happen. I lean towards supporting Arabs as I hate them slightly less then Jews. The problem is Arabs are shitty fighters. They outnumber the Jews they outunumber the Israelis yet have not managed to holocaust them. Jews are not even difficult to holocaust. Millions(I put the holocaust at about 1-3 million) died in the war and barely put up a fight.

That is honestly incorrect.
It is not logistically possible for many of the high numbers that died to have died.
We can also attribute many of the casualties to typhus.

However, that there was slave labour was obviously not to be denied (although, there were concentration camp guards who were Jewish). And that slaves lived in poor conditions is also not deniable. That systematic extermination was the original or always the goal is not particularly certain. However, Jews do not have a monopoly on being used as slave military labour because the Poles and Czech were used also. Indeed, many of the enslaved Jews were Polish/Czech.
As for Polish ghettos, which were more prevalent than camps, Jews did fight back. All the time. I do not begrudge them for fighting against an occupying force. If I were Polish, I would probably fight Germans alongside them. Polish nationalism or will to survive is not wrong...


Also, you have fallen victim to another form of propaganda. What disturbs me the most about "the Holocaust" is that many people suffered in WWII, and most of them were not Jews at all. The German people suffered and Eastern Europeans suffered. Dresden was a true Holocaust (in the sense that Latin "caust" means "burn"). Tens of millions suffered in the war, and you can hardly say victims of WWII were Jews. That is just an example of Jewish monopoly on WWII. And it blinds people to the casualties everywhere. The German, Polish, and Russian people.
Honestly, I am not interested in reading anything more about the Jewish Holocaust. If only "3 million" Jews were "easily" Holocausted anyway then that makes Jews very fortunate. Because over 50 million civilians died in that war. Germany lost Prussia, many lives, Stadtschloss, Dresden (which was architecturally and artistically beautiful. The most beautiful city in the world many had said). And looting of places like Sanssouci.

is this your source dude ?

I first read something similar to that, but not on a blog. Possibly the author of that blog derived inspiration from a similar source (it seems very similar, actually). Some of it is wrong also. For example, Bevor Hitler Kam is not banned in Germany. Neither is Hitler: Founder of Israel nonexistent.
Some of that blog is verbatim from the books I sited though. And suspiciously verbatim of something else I once read...

#16
Svitanok

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I like this thread. Not because I am a philosemitic National Socialist, not because I am an antisemitic Hitler-hater, not even because it would be an interesting historical fact - it is not of course, it seems to consist mainly of bullshit with some bits of truth scattered here and there (like quite a lot of sources about NS Germany). I like it because it has huge potential to make stormfags or other dumbass pseudonazis (especially the American ones, they seem to be the most dedicated internet-"NS") cry. I seriously suggest you post it in spermfront's "Revisionism" subforum, just for shits and giggles.
"The times of embroidered shirts, svytas and horilka are gone forever and will never return. The Ukrainian intelligentsia stands up to fight for her people, to fight fiercely, giving no quarter. She believes in her power and the power of her nation, and she will do her duty." - Mykola Mikhnovsky

"The manifestation of will is nothing but a delight in expansion, in going beyond one's borders." - Dmytro Dontsov

#17
British Blackshirt

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Is 'Bevor Hitler Kam' the book written by Rudolf Von Sebottendorf, the founder of the Thule Society, which Rudolf Hess was a member of?

http://www.crystalinks.com/thule.html

#18
Traum von Eisen

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Der Lowe, you are a German Jew and I have no problem with that, I quite respect you, to be honest, and I also could not care less if what you are saying is true or not(I highly doubt that it is, though.) But just because you are a Jew, it doesn't mean that you must transform the Third Reich into the Juden Reich. You are a German and an Atheist, so stop trying to be Kosher and justifying National Socialism from a Jewish perspective.

#19
Mierce

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But just because you are a Jew, it doesn't mean that you must transform the Third Reich into the Juden Reich.

Have you never noticed how Jews are expelled from pretty much everywhere they go? In a strong National Socialist Germany, it would have to be an expulsion by fire. It is the nature of the German (beyond that - the gentile) to hate the Jew. An ideology that venerated and was supposedly based around Judaism would be the only way for the Kikes to survive.
6,000,000

#20
Der Löwe

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Der Lowe, you are a German Jew and I have no problem with that, I quite respect you, to be honest, and I also could not care less if what you are saying is true or not(I highly doubt that it is, though.) But just because you are a Jew, it doesn't mean that you must transform the Third Reich into the Juden Reich. You are a German and an Atheist, so stop trying to be Kosher and justifying National Socialism from a Jewish perspective.

Is 'Bevor Hitler Kam' the book written by Rudolf Von Sebottendorf, the founder of the Thule Society, which Rudolf Hess was a member of?

http://www.crystalinks.com/thule.html

Preuße, I wish I could claim credit for the inventions of what I have said but I can not. If you do not like historical review, then by all means ignore what does not agree with your beliefs. I am not justifying National Socialism from a Jewish perspective. I am recognizing the blatant fact that it is Aryan Zionism. There is also a difference between Zionism and being Jewish, just as there is a difference between being Aryan and being National Socialist. Yes I am essentially atheist, but I am still a Zionist and I still support National Socialism. It has absolutely nothing to do with Keshrut. Rather, it is a historical example of ideological solidarity.

Blackshirt, the one I use is the one that is NSDAP/and other documents subjected to historical review by Dietrich Bronder.
I do not recommend buying it necessarily. But it is available as a Torrent download, here.




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